The Podolskiy Method: Parenting an athlete
There is no roadmap for parenting. No "one size fits all". Together we will learn what works and what does not work. Join and listen to doctors, coaches, athletes, parents, and many other guests of all walks of life. Lets take "parenting an athlete" to the next level and give them the right tools for the job.
The Podolskiy Method: Parenting an athlete
Hockey Dreams and Coaching Realities with NHL Alumni Boo Nieves
Former NHL player and coach Boo Nieves joins us to share his transformative journey from a multi-sport upbringing in Syracuse, New York, to finding his true calling on the ice. Through humorous tales, like rollerblading around his house to impress his parents, Boo reveals the unique challenges and rewards of both roller and ice hockey, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic in Florida. Listeners will gain insight into how hockey skills have evolved over the years and the cultural contrasts in coaching styles across the globe.
Boo and I also explore the nuances of youth hockey development, recounting experiences from prestigious tournaments such as the Quebec Pee-Wee Tournament. We shed light on the pressures young athletes face and emphasize the significance of resilience and work ethic. From being scouted to facing setbacks, Boo's candid reflections on his personal journey underscore the importance of education alongside athletics, offering inspiration to aspiring players and their families.
Our conversation delves into the exciting transition from college to the professional leagues, with Boo Nieves sharing his exhilarating signing experience with the New York Rangers. We also discuss the physical demands of the AHL and the setbacks of injuries, which led Boo to pivot from playing to coaching. This episode serves as a testament to the resilience required to navigate a sports career, encapsulating the rewarding cycle of teaching and learning, and offering valuable lessons for athletes at every stage of their journey.
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Good morning everybody and welcome back to the Podolsky Method podcast. Before we start, I'd like to remind you of our sponsors. Print Only With Us, a full printing shop here in Brooklyn, New York, If anybody's looking for some shirts or some cool swag. They do pretty much everything, including printing on metal, so it's a lot of fun. Swag they do pretty much everything, including printing on metal. It's a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:Make sure you check out WorkGate Hockey, WorkGateHockeycom for 10% off. You can use the code 10PODOLSKIY that's 10 Podolski. Workgate creates a face mask that goes underneath your visor so you can protect those teeth when you play hockey. Check out our friends at Howie Hockey for 10% off. With them, Use the code P-O-D-O-L-S-K-I-Y 1-0. That's Podolsky 10. And you can get your tape and whatever hockey needs you have. Of course, check out the Junior Rangers programming.
Speaker 1:As you guys remember, we serve the community by having 10 sessions and full gear included in this learn-to-play programs to introduce kids to hockey and get them to love the game. We're in, I believe, 60 rings or so around the Tri-State area, so definitely give them a look at nhlcom slash rangers, slash community, slash youth dash hockey, and check out my website, thebodalskymethodcom. I'm your creator and host Coach Oya Bodalsky, Level 5 USA Hockey Master Coach. Creator and host of the Bodalsky Method. Owner and operator of Skate Sharp Big Shop, called Sharp Skate New York, here in New York, and a USA Hockey coach developer and a CPA by trade. And today I have a wonderful guest with me, Christopher Buyeves. Did I say that right?
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, you did Well done, thank you.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Just to give you a little bit of background. He plays for the NHL, he's a coach and he established the top line elite hockey. Would you want to tell folks a little bit about yourself?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I am now, wow, currently 30 years old, and I remember some of the first times I took a step on the ice. I think I was, I want to say, four or five years old and all of the kind of similar to what the Rangers do now like kind of learn to play. I grew up in Syracuse, new York, so not much going on up there other than hockey in the winter, lacrosse in the summer, made my way to prep school, college, and then eventually found myself fortunate enough to play at MSG. So, yeah, we can dive more into that later on, but yeah, just a little bit about me.
Speaker 1:Awesome. So, boog, what was it like growing up? Were your parents supporting your hockey ambition, your sports? Did you play a lot of different sports or just hockey?
Speaker 2:So actually I played every single sport except hockey, and hockey was the last one, um, so I was, um, I'm one of four siblings, um, I have an older sister and older brother and a younger sister, um, and my dad had actually played, uh, division two basketball at le moyne, which is a small, small school in um, in syracuse. So he, he loved basketball, he loved football, so those were his two kind of primary sports and obviously he pushed us in those directions. And you go to the YMCA or whatever recreation centers near your house and you play football, you play soccer, you play basketball, baseball, whatever it may be, and I was good, I just I just didn't love them. You know, it felt like I was like, oh, it's like the thing I do, right, and I think I picked up hockey because I was rollerblading around and we had we had wooden floors in our kitchen and it would drive my parents absolutely nuts because I was scuffing up the floors and everything and they're like just go outside, just rollerblade outside.
Speaker 2:So I would roll a bit outside and I got pretty good at it and I think eventually their parents were just like, I don't know, maybe we should let them try hockey and um, I remember the first time I skated I don't know why, I remember this I was such a good skater. I was helping the coach give, you know, like the little support beams, like the little like sometimes they're like sea otters or whatever, like you know, and I was helping the coaches bring them to the other kids, and my parents were like, all right, I think we found a sport. Um, so yeah, that's, that was kind of my little entry level to, uh, to hockey that's awesome, and so um you play roller hockey as well, or just throw with it um, not too much roller hockey.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know people ask that. Honestly, no, I I just got into it by rollerblading. Um, I I played, but not like in a serious league or anything like that, like maybe in the street here and there, but mostly like street hockey when I was home. That was just kind of like my entry level to it. But I did try it actually when I was um over covid. Um, my family lives in florida now and I moved down there over COVID and I tried to play roller hockey with some guys and I was actually getting like made fun of because I kept falling and like it's a totally different dynamic, like it's a totally different game and I didn't understand it. I couldn't really cross over, I couldn't really stop and these guys are like this guy plays in the NHL and I was like I got to figure this out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I had a similar experience, but reversed, because I started playing role hockey. Because in Brooklyn we didn't have a lot of rinks so we would play role hockey like six, seven hours a day every day. Yeah, we got really good at it and then at some point we decided to switch to ice and our whole team went. You know, we all converted and I remember everybody's like stumbling around and then we tried to do both you like have a game of roller and then two hours away, there you're on the ice and you can't transition because it's completely different type of like movement skating it is no, you're right.
Speaker 2:Like people don't understand that. Like it's like the stopping is totally different and the way, the way, like the movements of roller hockey is like you get speed and you can kind of like glide, like you can use your speed right and, and it's more of like three on three style, right, it's like possession, where it's like if you don't like it, you kind of turn away. If you don't like it, you turn away and you wait till something opens up, whereas, like ice hockey, like coach is screaming on the bench like get the puck, go to him, pressure him, him, pressure him, go to him. Like you want someone to attack you, you know, head on with their shoulders squared to a roller hockey, that's easy. Like in hockey it's like, okay, I'm about to get crushed. Right now I got to be able to make a play with the puck.
Speaker 2:So, you're right, it's two totally different games and it is cool to be able to switch back. Hockey gives you, like the kids who play roller hockey growing up have really good hands, like their hands are unbelievable. But then I feel like when they get to ice, they struggle with the moving their feet with their hands simultaneously, and then vice versa with. You know ice hockey players who try to play roller like like it's too slow, like I'm getting frustrated, and then they end up getting beat because they don't have the patience. So it's. It is cool to learn those different dynamics yeah, the coordination thing goes out the window.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, it's gone.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, this is great. So once you took to hockey, how many days a week would you get on the ice?
Speaker 2:I want to say, when I first was doing learn-to-play, it was like one practice a week and then whatever games on the weekend, maybe one Saturday, one Sunday morning kind of thing, um, and then I started playing, um, double a. I actually never, I didn't play triple a right away, um, because my parents, we weren't a hockey family and I mean, obviously, as you know, a lot of people I'm sure listening to this, understand that like it's, it's still a very unique sport. It's it's an ever-changing landscape and unless you come from a hockey family, like you, don't know where to go, who to play, what travel like, what travel teams, what tournaments, single a, double a, whatever. So we just we ended up in double a. It was just a local rink and it was easy, it was convenient and, um, I think from the age of whatever it it's like seven or eight, I think, when I started playing squirts, I was double A and I was probably practicing, I want to say, once or twice a week and then same thing, games on the weekend.
Speaker 1:Nice. Yeah, I think it's similar now but, like for our squirts and up, even my team now have like three practices during the week. One is like a skills practice, then you have two team practices and then the games on the weekend. So I think there's a lot more demand and that's happening at the levels from development all the way up through AA, and I'm sure AAA has even more commitment than those AA and A programs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, commitment than than those double a and a programs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I, I. I think I think what happened honestly is you're right like the demand for ice obviously went up, so then parents and kids wanted to get on the ice more, but I think that there was definitely, um, you know, a lack of, like you just said, like development, of like skill development and team development, of like learning play development, learning hockey, iq, learning how to play without the puck, and I think that I think my generation kind of missed that. I feel like we started getting on the ice more than other kids, but we weren't really using that time efficiently, like we weren't learning things that these kids you know, who are entering NHL now know, right. So I think that we're now just starting to catch up and we're understanding, like you said, like that's a great schedule One skill session, two team practices Like that's awesome. Because I feel like when I was growing up, it was just like whatever the coach wanted to do that day, or there wasn't really much of a model and it was just like let's get on the ice more no-transcript.
Speaker 1:They're just phenomenal skaters, like skill wise. It's just so much different, Do you?
Speaker 2:think that's the result of that transition that you just mentioned. Yeah, absolutely I. I think that I think that there was a point where skills was seen as like oh, can you flip a puck over your stick and toe drag? And now skills are can you skate full speed up the ice and catch a backhand pass? That's cross ice.
Speaker 2:Like that's an elite skill, like I think that when you go and you kind of boil down what skills are, you can ask you know a hundred different people, and I'm sure you know a thousand people too, and it's the same. You'll get a different answer from everybody. But I think, collectively, when you do get to those levels, the skill level is through the roof. Like I wasn't learning that stuff and the kids who even are a couple years younger than me, the stuff that they're learning and the stuff that they're able to do. It's incredible but it's efficient and it's useful, though Some of the skill stuff we would have wasn't very useful.
Speaker 2:I'm never going to really flip a puck over a stick in the middle of a game as a coach on the ice. That would drive me nuts and I'm sure it would drive you nuts too, right, so I want to see the kid who can get the puck across his body and weight transfer and drop his shoulder and drive to the net. That's an elite skill. So, yeah, no, the skill level is through the roof and it's clearly only getting better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like you made a great point just now because you see that all the time there's always that kid trying to do the michigan. You know, by the wall behind that right? Yeah, it's fun in school, like I'm all for it, but you, you know chances are you never gonna use in the game and you know if you try to, you know, at the older levels you get rocked. At the younger levels, you know, everybody gets managed no, you're right.
Speaker 2:It's crazy like you'll be standing there like running a skill session and you know the first three kids are paying attention, and there's the one kid who's got his back turned to you and he's like trying to get the puck off the wall. I'm like can you please like listen? If you can pull it off in the drill, great, but just pay attention so we can get through the drill, and that's an added bonus that I'm happy to let you do.
Speaker 1:But we got to get through this first right, I always try to put the kid in the front of the line. So you, you know, you call them in and you see who's the straggler, who's like just played with the puck.
Speaker 2:I was like you, you're going first yep, yep, hey, if you've got hands, you want to show it, go ahead, prove it yeah, you're the first one.
Speaker 1:The drill yeah, I remember uh, you know I coach with uh a couple of European coaches and they're amazing coaches and they always tell me stories. He's like when we were kids growing up, you know, like Russia and training. He's like you never wanted to go first because if you messed up a drill, your coach would kick you in the behind and like whack you with a stick and be like what are you doing? He's like now you're like who wants to go?
Speaker 2:Every single kid's like me and nobody understood what you like the drill is yeah, because like there's no consequences here, right, and that's such a funny point because we were actually just one of my colleagues at Topline, justin Selman. We went to China in August and some of the kids were like not paying attention and this was the craziest thing. The coach would come over and like kind of whack them with the stick and like the first time it happened, like me and Justin looked at each other like oh my God, like oh my God, there's like live bar here, like this person's going to get in so much trouble, and then like another kid messed up and like whack and I'm like, okay, this is like normal here, so whack. And I'm like, okay, this is like normal here. So, um, no, it's funny you brought that up because I feel like when, when we were kids, like yeah, you could get away with it, like a coach kind of like give you a little whack and you're like okay, okay, okay, like I'll do it, I'll do it right now, like that's.
Speaker 1:That doesn't apply no, no, yeah, different culture. So talk to me a little bit about, you know, your transition from youth hockey and I know you. You know I listened to you talk a little bit about the PV tournament because I was at your tryout for the Quebec PV team. For those listening, I was one of the head coaches for the Quebec PV team for the New York Rangers. Quebec has one of the biggest tournaments for PV level hockey. It's pretty cool. So maybe you could talk a little bit about your experience at that tournament and your transition from youth into your professional career yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I, I think I I stepped into triple a hockey. I want to say I was, I think, my second year squirts or first year of peewee. I want to say so. I got a couple of years of AA before I made the transition and then I went to AAA and, as you said, I grew up in Syracuse. I was playing for the Syracuse Stars and my coach at the time was Steve Sibeli, who now works with NYSHA, helps with the festival tournaments. I'm sure a lot of people have seen him and talked to him and I talk to him a lot. He's honestly one of arguably the best things that's ever happened to me in ice hockey and we still have a really good relationship. So, yeah, I made the jump and I went to that tournament. I think you're 12. Yeah, it's 12 of you, I want to say.
Speaker 2:And we went there. For us it was a little bit different because I don't think the charters were as I don't know if they were existed or as serious I guess you would say, because we went with our Syracuse team. We had a bid and at the time, jacob Chuba, who's in New York now, we grew up playing against each other. He was in CompuWare Andrew Kopp was on that team and then Little Caesars went as their own team, honey Bake went as their own team, the Colonials went All of these teams that we would normally play they went as their own team, whereas, as we know, now you need the charter and there's, like, the Rangers have a team, who you know I coached with Brian Mullen and Steve Arulo, and you know, the Devils have their team and the Islanders have their team. So it's definitely different, definitely different landscape now, but my experience there was. It was awesome.
Speaker 2:I, I, I just remember like hanging out in the hotel like for like it just felt like it went on forever, right, and it's cool because you, when you stay, you lose, you go home, so it was kind of like a do or die attitude and you're just with all your best friends, 12 years old, just living out of a hotel for like it's like a what a week and a half, two weeks almost. And um, you go to the snow park and you do the toboggan and I think one of the coolest parts about it is like in New York city, if you took every, you know, basketball court or tennis court or any of those everywhere in Quebec, those are all rinks, like you could walk, you know, half a mile in any direction you'll find a rink and it's cool because there's locals out there in jeans and mittens, and then there's there's kids out there who are 12 years old playing in the Quebec tournament, and we would just play with locals and you would get the they call them like the beaver tails, which is like the fried dough, like the cinnamon sugar, and we would just sit there and eat those and drink hot chocolate until literally our parents dragged us off the ice. And no, I mean, it's such an incredible tournament and we were fortunate we made it to the semifinals, but it was kind of silly for us because we ended up playing the same four teams. I think it was us. We lost to CompuWare in the semifinals. It was us, compuware, little Caesars and the Marlins Sorry, not the Marlins, because the Toronto team don't go.
Speaker 2:I don't know some other Canadian team, no-transcript, don't make. One of these teams like you don't get to go and I don't know. I think for a lot of parents listening, though at the same times, it's like it isn't the end of the world. You know, I think that a lot of people put pressure on the kids to make this tournament. And there's plenty of kids who don't play in this tournament, who still play in the NHL and play college Like the Toronto teams, like we said, don't even go Right. So you know, think about Toronto as a whole. Like you can name a thousand NHLers who have played over a thousand games and none definitely not make or break for the kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, no, and my older one ended up not making the team and he's playing double-A hockey. He's loving it. You know, the best part was that he wasn't upset about it. I got some feedback about what he needs to work on things like that, which was great, so I was at that. I think it was the first tryout that you guys had in Palisades a couple of years ago.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And it was wonderful. One is that I know all the guys working with the Junior Rangers, so it was great to see everybody. But two, I got, you know, different perspectives from you guys as coaches and stuff like that. It was just really cool experience. The panel that mike benelli ran was was wonderful. You know, I just thought it was really really cool for the two days, uh, that we were there. Um, you know, hit him on the ice playing against you know, some of the best kids at that age group in the area. It was really really cool. So even the tryout itself was like phenomenal yeah, no, yeah, no.
Speaker 2:I I think the rangers they do a really good job honestly, like you said, like mike benelli does such a good job with the panel, and you know it is one of the first times where a lot of parents get to sit there and say like hey, like what did you do growing up? Like what teams did you play for? Were you a triple, a player you know out of? And you know a lot of people are surprised to hear that. You know most of us aren't like everybody's got a little bit of a different path and I think that there's, like we said, there's so much pressure to put on these kids at such a young age to make these teams and you know I mean as we'll talk about, you know, kind of fuels the fire and I think that it's it's helpful that they do give the feedback they do right and, like you said, it's one of the first times where most of these kids find out kind of, where they stack up against some of the better players in the area and it's eye-opening for some kids and it's, at the end of the day, like that's all you can ask for is a good experience for the kids yeah, and you know I had a situation now where you know I have my middle kid was phenomenal and one of the top kids last year in squirts.
Speaker 1:And then you move up to peewee and it's a completely different story. He's struggling a little bit in the beginning of the season and then, you know right, all of a sudden there's a lot of emotion and a lot of like. You know, I was one of the best last year. Then you know, now I'm my third wine guy. And then you know we had a conversation about hey, you know, like the only way I know how to get better is to go to work, go to practice, show up every day, put in the work. That's going to build your confidence because you're doing a little bit more than maybe the next guy. You know, do some off ice at home when nobody's looking, and then eventually you're going to get to to be one of the top guys again. I was like, but you're now a year younger than everybody else, cause the next age group is. You know you're progressing and so so just, it's a good opportunity, like a good teaching moment to work through that adversity.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean, like when things are just kind of not going your way and you're like, oh, adversity, you know like when things are just kind of not going your way and you're like, oh, all of a sudden, I'm not the best, and you're like, okay, well, just go back to work, it's okay, yeah, no, it is. And I think that it's almost better for these kids to experience this at a younger age, because I think, for me personally, one of my biggest flaws in my development was I never really experienced this until I got to, you know, like like college and pro, and a lot of these kids, I think, who experienced this now as they get older, like it doesn't phase them, like it's just another challenge, it's another day, whereas someone like me, I didn't understand that until I got to you know, the pro level, and I think that it definitely was detrimental to my development, for sure. And and then I think, on the other side of it, as you know, like there's also. I think part of the problem, though, is like I think the way you just handled your situation was great.
Speaker 2:Like you tell your kid you get to work, like it is what it is, like it's a very humbling sport and you'll get there, but I think that that's one of the worst things you can do with these kids, cause you see, you know he played for the avalanche this year and then he went to Woodbridge and now he's over at the Colonials and it's just like you know what's the common denominator here? It's always the coach's fault, or it's always the other kids on the other team, and it's never you know what. Maybe we just need to go back to the grindstone and get back to. You know the basics.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, I'm glad you said that, because I talk a lot on the show about kitchen talk, or what I call kitchen talk is when parents standing, you know, visually I imagine parents standing in the kitchen, the kid being around the wall, and they start to go oh, the coach just doesn't like our kid, that's why he's playing on the slide, that's why he doesn't play power, play whatever, whatever, whatever and it's all. Coach, bad, organization is bad, this is bad, that's bad. And then the kid shows up and loses interest in what the coach has to say. And so you know, have you seen that happening with kids that you're coaching now? Or the kids as you were growing up, like your teammates, where that really impacted their psyche and the way they perform?
Speaker 2:yeah, no, a hundred percent. Um, kids I grew up with, yeah, absolutely like. There were kids who you know were absolutely studs at, you know, 13, 14 years old. And you know my coach, steve sabelli, growing up was he's really hard to play for, like I. I was probably our best player but he was the hardest on me, like if I wasn't back checking, if I wasn't sending a good example like I. He never made hockey easy for me, which was probably why he was the best thing that ever happened to me right in the game of in the sport.
Speaker 2:But there was kids who were studs and they didn't understand that, you know. You know sometimes he would have me penalty kill and not have me on the power play, you know, at 13 years old, like, and that's fine, because that's what he needed me to do. Or sometimes he would just randomly throw me in front of the net or take a face off and just get off the ice. Like that that's just your role. And some kids don't understand that.
Speaker 2:And I think the other side of that too is a lot of people parents start freaking out because if their kid's on the third line on, you know, whatever x organization doesn't mean they can't be a first liner at y organization the next year. Like they think that their kid is now being labeled and, you know, molded into the specific player and like, no, it's actually up to you and your child to figure out. Okay, this is our role this year and next year we're going to have a different role. How are we going to adapt? It's not. My kid had 45 goals last year and he only has 12. And we're at Christmas, like. I can promise you, these colleges aren't going to call you and ask you or look up elite prospects and see how many goals your kid had when they were 10 years old. It's irrelevant. Okay, it's if your kid can play the game at a high level and think the game at a high level and adapt at a high level.
Speaker 1:Right, that's such a great point because, you know, I was at a training that Junior Rangers organized and we had somebody from USA Hockey show up and I remember the gentleman's name. I'm actually, you know, now that I joined the coach developer program for USA Hockey and I get to teach. I always think back to the way this guy delivered his message and he um had this video on screen. He pulled up cindy crosby. He's like cindy crosby was a first round pick and his partners when he won the stanley cup, one was a seventh round pick and one was an eighth round pick and they were all the same line and he's like do you think his mom called the coach and was like, hey, why the hell is my first round pick playing with the seventh and eighth rounders? He's like, and it was just such a cool, like respect. I was like this, I'm gonna steal that.
Speaker 2:I was like this is so good no, that is like, that's awesome, like that, that that's it to its heat, like it's, it's, it's insane. There's just this like if you, if you gave these parents what they wanted, right, I would have a 2010 skating with the college guys who skate with me and I would have the college guys skating with the NHL guys who skate with us. Like it, it doesn't work like that. Like I think that there's this never ending level of you know, they just want, they just want the next level, they want what's what's next, they want what's right above them. And listen, I understand it from hey, I want my kid to be pushed. That's great, I understand that and I appreciate that.
Speaker 2:But hockey is an intrinsically motivating sport. There's I didn't play up at all. Growing up, for example, I played. I'm a 94. I played with 94s my whole entire life until you get to whatever you 16.
Speaker 2:And then it's two birth years, right, my, my whole life I grew up playing with 94s because my parents felt like, yeah, he could have played up with the 93s, but if him playing up is the only way he's going to be motivated, then how is he going to manage when he's 20 years old, sitting in a college locker room and his, his line mates 25 and his other line mates 18. Like how are you going to handle that? And especially, you know, if you get to pro? Like my first time I stepped in the locker room I think I was like 23, 24 years old, you know there were guys who were pushing 40 with two kids and there were literal kids, 18 years old, who had made the team, like Filipino out of camp.
Speaker 2:Like you have to be able to understand those dynamics that these ages, they genuinely don't matter where these kids come from, don't matter. It's you're playing for your next shift and it's hard to explain to the kids and I know you feel the same way. It's hard to explain it to them until there's money being put into your bank account because of your performance and that's what pays for your life. Right, it's hard because they're going to go home, they're going to have their meal, they're going to have a comfortable bed, no matter what. But when you're playing for you know your life, it a lot of things change right.
Speaker 1:So I know earlier you mentioned a little bit about your uh against disappointments as you were growing, going into, you know, college and into pro career. Can you talk a little bit about that and how that kind of fueled you to get to the next level?
Speaker 2:yeah, absolutely so. I, um, I stayed in Syracuse until I played U16. Um, and that was my last year. And then my parents were like, okay, you know, it's time for us to make a decision. Um, and I was probably one of the better 94s in the country.
Speaker 2:Um and NTDP had been watching me for years. Um, that was always on their radar. Always, speaking to those guys, they actually flew me out and had me visit, like, the facilities, the school. They had me meet the counselors and like everything. They're like these are the people you're going to send your, you know, like from your public school. Like, when you come here, these are the people you need to be in contact with. Blah blah, blah. This is where you're going to eat lunch. This with blah blah blah. This is where you're gonna eat lunch. This is where you're gonna go school. When you get out of the rink, this is your billet. Feel like this, all of this stuff. And I'm just like, wow, cool, this is amazing. And actually on the same trip was jacob shruva and seth jones and I was like, wow, this is so cool, like we're gonna do this together.
Speaker 2:And then the 40 man camp came around. I had a good tryout not great, not bad. Um, and like at that point, you know everybody at the tryout, um, so there's like no, everyone's a familiar face. And they released the team and I got cut and I I just remember like sitting in the car with my dad and like my heart just sank and I was like what do you mean I got? I've never been cut. Like that's, this is a mistake. Like I, I'm me, I shouldn't have been, because this is, this is impossible. And my dad's like yeah, they didn't, they didn't pick you. And I was just like I just like lost it. I was just like why? Like what do you mean? Like what's wrong with me? And he was just like you know, they had a phone call and I didn't advise her at the time and I was committed to Michigan at the time, I committed a very young age. And they were just like, yeah, you, you just, we didn't feel like you know your style of play fits, you know who we have. We feel like we have guys that can do your strengths better than you and your weaknesses. We have guys that are filling those spots. And I was just like wow.
Speaker 2:I honestly considered like I don't even know if I want to do this anymore, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And my parents were like, okay, relax, we're going to take some time. I took a couple weeks off this was in the spring, I think. So I had nowhere to play in the fall and it's crazy because I'm this 15-year-old kid who's committed to Michigan and I don't even have a place to play in the fall. So I was like you know what? Screw this? I want to go to the USHL and I want to play the 17s for those people aren't familiar the under 17, under 18 national program play in the ushl. So I wanted to go to the ushl to prove them wrong, play them.
Speaker 2:My parents were like, absolutely not, you're going to boarding school.
Speaker 2:And I was like boarding school, like I don't want to go to boarding school.
Speaker 2:Why would I go to boarding school?
Speaker 2:And they're like because you already have a commitment to a very good school.
Speaker 2:Um, the coach at the time, matt her, who now works with the nhl, played in the NHL, was the coach there and he was a Michigan alumni and Michigan called me and they were like hey, like go play for this man, matt Herr, he's awesome, he's built a really good program at Kent. You're going to get a really good education. You're going to have plenty of time to lift, become a man, get stronger and come to us at 18, you know, ready to go and I like fine. And I'll tell you what. It was probably the best decision you know I ever made in my whole entire life. Um, you know, here I'm here in la visiting, you know, my friend who had a baby, and she was, you know, at boarding school with me. That's where I met her and her mom ended up being my financial advisor for the years I was playing. Um, so much networking and so many good things came out of it. So, but no, that was my first experience of really getting cut from a team.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. I love that story and how that developed into this whole life for you right, and you know, I know one of the kids he was actually on the show as well Daniel Dijanjev. He plays Penn State Division I now. He played for the national team for a couple of years and people were saying, you know his size was an issue, but he's you know he's now playing Division I and you know I think that's a pretty phenomenal feat for any hockey player, even if you don't go anywhere after that. You know, if you don't want to play pro or you know there's a lot of options now to play pro in europe and everything else, but uh, even if you didn't want to, I feel like if my kid make it to d3 or do d1 college levels, you know it's phenomenal no, it is, it's, it's.
Speaker 2:It opens up so many avenues and and I mean I, I think, as we can talk about a little later but but I think that you know a lot of these players who are going to college are starting to develop at a later rate, which means you know they're stepping into the NHL, but they're ready to play in the NHL at 25, 26. Whereas, yes, you know, you're going to have your unicorns that are 18, 19 years old. They're going to make the team, but there's two of them here. What about you know the to make the team? But there's, there's two of them here. What about you know the majority of the team? And there's 23 man rosters in the nhl.
Speaker 2:So you do the math if one of them's top five pick, that's five kids, okay, there's what? 33 teams in the nhl, 34 teams the nhl. Like, I think you start to boil it down and I think that you want to be one of those guys that's ready to go at 25, who's got the longevity? Who's ready to play? Who's who's got the longevity? Who's ready to play? Who's a man? Not, you know, the kid who makes the team at 18, that is, in the AHL at 19, then up and down at 20, and then finally sticks at 21. Listen, nothing wrong with that, but you want to go in, you want to be ready, you want to get there and you want to stay there.
Speaker 1:So playing? I wanted to ask you a little bit about your college playing career, because you're coming in right, you're a freshman and you basically playing guys who are like four years older, who are shaving and the whole nine year old. They got full beards. You're like the young kid. Uh, what that? What's that like? Like, did you? Did you get intimidated or is it like comfortable?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, honestly, thinking back, I don't know what was wrong with me, but I was just fearless, like I wasn't like a confrontational person, but I just didn't think much of it. And no, I mean we at Michigan, most of the freshman classes will be true freshmen, or you know one year of juniors, um, because a lot of us, you know, I think it was like three two years ago there was like the first overall pick, second overall pick, fourth, fifth, like listen, I mean that was an absurd year. But like every year you're getting a top 10 pick, like my year it was Truba had gone, I think whatever he top 15 and then I was a second rounder, cop was like a fourth rounder, um, and then I think the year that year to DGSEP, you went early in the in the second round too, like I mean you've got a first round or two second rounders in a fourth rounder, like that's like pretty crazy, right. And but for us, I think going to a place like michigan is such an advantage because it's geared towards a pro style game. We are treated like pros, we are expected to perform like pros, like when you go into.
Speaker 2:You know, my first year we were in the ccha, so we were playing miami of ohio, northern michigan lake, superior michigan state. Um, I'm missing a couple schools, century or sorry, western michigan um, a lot of schools that a lot of people probably haven't heard of. But the best part about those schools is we would go up to, say, northern michigan to plan a friday and saturday night and the place is sold out. Yes, yes, it only holds, say whatever, 4,000 people compared to these massive North Dakota stadiums. But these guys are 21, 22 year old freshmen. So when they're seniors, they are 24, 25, some of them are 26 years old. We're 18, 19, 20 year old little kids, highly touted, and it's the best thing for us to learn how to play against these men, like that was our Achilles heels playing against those bigger, older, faster, stronger teams. They would dump the puck and they would run you through the boards. The crowd would go wild and we were not used to that. We were used to catching a pass, circling back with our head up, making whatever plays comfortable for us. But you learn to play high level hockey and you learn to adapt. So I think, yeah, I mean, the first year was awesome. We had a really good team.
Speaker 2:Um, unfortunately, my sophomore year had a bit of a sophomore slump. I struggled because that was also another learning year for me. Um, because jt comfort came in. He was like a late first rounder or early second rounder. Tyler mod had come in and those guys like that just bumped us all down right and that in our freshman year Kopp had an unbelievable year. So sophomore year Kopp was actually made an assistant captain, so he was first line, he was running it, and then JT Comfort came in, highly touted, he was made second line and my sophomore year I found myself on the third line. And then JT Comfort came in, highly touted, he was made second line and myself I found myself on the third line and I'm just like how is this possible? I'm a second round pick, like what is going on? And it was a bit of a learning curve.
Speaker 2:You know, I played with a lot of different guys, I learned to play a little bit of a different role, um, and then junior year made a bounce back, um, but again it was definitely a struggle because then junior year came and I think it was uh who came in that year I want to say it was Dylan. Yeah, I think that was Larkin. Yeah, I think that was Larkin came in my life. That was my senior year. This was like Cooper, marodi and all these guys, um.
Speaker 2:And then senior year was also a struggle because I found myself kind of teeter-tottering between second and third line again because Dylan Larkin had come in and I mean, like what do you?
Speaker 2:You're not going to put him behind any of us. So like that kind of bumped us down again and but no, I mean it was good because that's a pro style game, right. Like you're in a locker room with guys who are coming in signing big deals and yeah, like if you guys sign a big deal, he's going to come in and see you on the first line and you're going to get bumped on the second. And then if another guy comes in, you're going to get bumped on the third. And, like you said, like your parents don't call a college coach and say, hey, you know, little Johnny's upset had 30 goals. You know, in youth hockey like that doesn't happen. Like you said, you show up, you grind, you work, you figure it out. And I think one of my favorite stories from my college experience is Zach Hyman. And what a lot of people don't know about Zach Hyman is this kid was the hardest working person I've ever met in my entire life.
Speaker 1:I've never met anybody like him.
Speaker 2:He was there a year before me. He barely played his freshman year. Um his sophomore year he started to get in pretty regularly but like bottom six, fourth line grinder. His junior year he was on my line and I don't know what happened, but he just I mean, he worked every, every, every year he worked. He was always number one in fitness testing and we did a lot of off-ice admission Like we were packed and he was always finishing first Every time we had a back skate, always finished first, always worked on his skills, like and I know people hear these stories and they're thinking yeah, blah, blah, blah. I'm sure he did Like no, you don't understand, this guy had to be dragged off the ice, dragged off the turf. So junior year he starts playing pretty well and I don't know what happened.
Speaker 2:But at Christmas I just feel like everything just clicked for this kid. He was coming in, he was like a point per game from Christmas on the way out. And I just remember this specific play against Minnesota. We were, we were out there and it was like late in the game. I think we were down by a couple goals and he just made the strongest power move. He just caught across the ice, took like three guys with him, tucked it behind the goalie and and I was like Holy smokes, like Hyman, like what is going on?
Speaker 2:His senior year? Dylan Larkin comes in, they play together, they mesh. Hyman almost wins the Hobie Baker award, goes and plays a little in the AHL. Next thing you know he's playing in Toronto and he just was in the Stanley cup finals last year playing on Connor McDavid's line. So like that's one of my favorite stories to tell people, because people don't understand that kid's path. People don't understand, like you were saying before, the grind and the sticking-to-it-ness and the discipline and the resilience that a lot of these kids show, which eventually land them a spot in, you know, the greatest league in the world.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love. Thank you so much for sharing that story because you know you're absolutely right. I think people don't. Really. They lose perspective very quickly. They tend to just kind of forget that. You know it's not an overnight success, nobody's just born. And then the next day they're like oh, now I'm in the nhl, look at me, like the work that goes into it behind the scenes there's, there's this uh, really cool, um, I guess meme that was going around that says they only show you the one moment it was successful, but the 356 before that where he missed the shot, missed the net or lost the puck every time he tried to do that drill. Nobody actually puts it up on their social media so folks can see the failures is what gets you to that success, and you know you got to try it 300 times until you get it right once oh my god, yeah, no, it's, it's so true and and and it's it's.
Speaker 2:He's such a cool story and and you know it was it's still so cool to see him, you know, playing it at such a high level and um, and he still does so much charity work off the ice like he's. He's a true role model and you know, I'm so fortunate to have played with him at uh, it's such a prestigious school awesome, so talk to me a little bit about getting into that pro career mode.
Speaker 1:So now you're out of college, you get to the nhl. What was that like when you had to like sign your first deal with the rangers?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, that was so. That was that was exciting. Um I um. So after my junior year, I had a pretty good year and I actually remember being pulled into red berenson's office and he was just like there's a lot of speculation. A lot of us were leaving because zach wierenski was was going to leave after one year and d giuseppe had left and you know we had a little bit of a turnover and and I remember red kind of sat me down.
Speaker 2:For those people who don't know Red Berenson, this is one of the most intimidating men. He does not smirk, he does not smile. He was one of the first college players to ever play in the NHL. One of the first players to ever wear a helmet in the NHL. He used to do taxes for the Montreal Canadiens because none of the guys had a college education. This guy is the world's most interesting man. I, because none of the guys had a college education. Like this guy is like world's most interesting man.
Speaker 2:And I remember sitting in his office and he was just like we just sat there, like he sat down, I sat down and he just like looked at me for like a good two, three minutes and I'm just like what's going on Red, and he's just like how are you? And I'm like I'm good. And he no-transcript called and he was like hey, we got the deal done. Blah, blah, blah. So he's like tomorrow they're going to send the paperwork over, we'll find a place you can sit, sign it, whatever. I'm like okay, great. And I was waiting to figure out where I was going to go, because I didn't really plan to go straight to new york. But I didn't really know because they were kind of going into playoffs I don't know if they want to carry an extra body just to get me on the ice a little bit. I didn't expect to play with new york, but, like you know.
Speaker 2:So I go to spanish class the next day and I'm like glued to my phone because I'm waiting for jefforton, who was the GM at the time, to call me. You know to say like hey, like well, congratulations, it's that this is what we're doing. And I was in Spanish class and my Spanish teacher was just like you need to put your phone away. And I'm just like okay, like listen, it's just really important. And they're like I'm sure it's important, everyone's important, like put your phone away. And I'm like okay. So I'm like kind of sitting there, like looking at it, and finally my teacher snaps and she's like give me your phone. And I'm like no, no, no, no, no, like I cannot give you my phone, like this is. And she just like took it and there's nothing on her desk except for my phone and it's facing up and I'm just sitting there like I'm looking at my watch and like there's 30 minutes left in class and I'm just like please, can I see my phone? She's like nope. She's like I don't care if this is the most important phone call. You're like I'm like it is like I need to pick up this phone call. She's like nope, she's like you're not. And I just sat there and he called like two more times and I'm just like the GM of the New York Rangers thinks I'm ignoring him. Right now. This guy's giving me a life-changing event and I can't even you know, I can't even pick up my phone. So finally I get to talk to him after and I'm like I'm so sorry. Like I was in class. He's like it's all good. He's like I'd rather you be in class than you know chatting with me and um, but no, it was exciting.
Speaker 2:I ended up going to Hartford right after I went to the AHL, and which was great I think we played. We finished up the season, which I think there was like 15 games left, and I did really well, actually, I think I I think I had like 14 points in like 15 games or something. It was awesome. They slotted me right in. But one thing I did learn, though, is it's easy to go from college to like the AHL because, like you're fresh, no one knows who you are. Like, you can kind of fly around, get away with things you wouldn't normally get away with. And also, too, what people don't understand about the pro league is like it's a grind like the end of the year, like, if you're not making playoffs, like yeah, you're still playing for another contract, but like guys are tired, guys are grinding down. I'm fresh out of college. I just played 40 games. These guys are on game whatever you know 62. And, as you know, the pro style game it's heavier, it's harder, it's longer. So, but no, that was my first experience of pro hockey, and it was incredible.
Speaker 2:And then that summer, I worked out in Connecticut with Ben Prentice. A lot of people are familiar with him. You know a lot of pro guys work out there. It was like Cam Atkinson, petretti, kreider, pesci, hayden, james, neal, like a lot of those guys at the time were working out there. So I got that under my belt. It was cool. That was like the first time I skated with pros, worked out with pros kind of thing. Skated with pros worked out with pros kind of thing.
Speaker 2:And then there's rookie tournaments. So going before training camp it's actually kind of like a really big advantage for rookies because you get to play in these rookie tournaments where they bring you in about a month earlier. You get on the ice with the coaches and it's all guys who have signed or guys who play in the CHL, because they're allowed to go to play in these tournaments and then without any commitment and then go back to their teams as free agents. But in college you lose your amateurism when you sign that contract. So it's only guys who have signed from college and potential guys that they're looking to pick from the OHL, chl, whatever.
Speaker 2:And so ours was Traverse City. So we go and we skate for whatever week. We go to Traverse City up in northern Michigan, like the UP, and it's like us I want to say it's Columbus, I don't even know, like Detroit and like a couple other teams, and I think what was cool for me that year was we had, I think, five guys from Michigan who had signed that year all playing in that specific tournament and every single guy wore a letter for their team, because it was like Zach Ranske for Columbus, jt Comfer what team was JT drafted? Buffalo, Tyler Mott was with I want to say, columbus or Chicago, and Justin Selma was with the St Louis Blues and then I was with New York and we all there with CRNA, which was pretty cool for us, and I played really well in that, actually really really well, and I was coming out of there with a boatload of confidence and the advantage to that is you get out of that tournament and you go straight to training camp, which is kind of a grind but you're also in great shape. You, you've been skating, you've been playing games, whereas a lot of these pro guys have just been working on it's getting.
Speaker 2:For the other two weeks that you were up there, um, but unfortunately my last game of Traverse City I had a concussion, um, which is a lot of people know is kind of like the story of the rest of my career, unfortunately, but um, so that kind of set me back. Didn't do training camp, that whole entire first year, which was frustrating because I feel like I had a pretty good chance to make the team. But ended up in Hartford the first year, played really well, got called up super early on to play a game, did well, told me, hey, you know, come Christmas we're going to look to get you back up here, you know, for something more permanent. And I was like this is great. Unfortunately, another concussion around christmas and then, you know, from then on I was kind of like up and down, always battling injury, um, but the entry to professional hockey was, you know, great.
Speaker 1:Everything after that it's a bit of a struggle yeah, folks, you know and I'm glad you mentioned the, the injuries and the concussions, because for for athletes go and thinking about going pro and you know you could be extremely good, but you know you get plagued a little bit with things like that, uh, you know, and that could throw your whole career out the window. I know, I wrestled in college, I wrestled d3, and we had this um phenomenal coach from iraq, uh, and he was a Olympic contender and blew out his knees and that was it his wrestling career. He was phenomenal, he was just jacked like unbelievable wrestler, but you know that was it, you know. So it's really tough when you have to deal with those, but you know you still got to have quite a bit of a professional career, which was awesome. And then tell me a little bit about your transition to coaching. How did that happen?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So I, officially, I think, I did my last year with New York and Hartford. Covid hit, and then I signed a one-year deal with Tampa and then got hurt again and I was just like all right, like I can't, I can't keep doing these. So I actually took a long time. It took about a year and a half off from hockey. I kind of traveled and just kind of, you know, figured out what else I wanted to do.
Speaker 2:And you know, top line was something that we had done when we were all playing in the minor leagues. You know, our first couple years of pro. It was just kind of a fun thing we did in New Jersey. Like we saw people putting on camps and stuff and we were like, you know, we've been to a lot of camps, we know what we like, we know what we don't like, so we put one on for fun and you know, the parents loved it, the kids loved it. So we did another one the next year and another one the next year and then COVID hit and and obviously, as people know, a lot of things kind of slowed down. So I was still playing or kind of finishing up.
Speaker 2:Justin Connor and RJ, who also run Topline with me. They all had started running sessions out of this place called the Anvil in Fairlawn, new Jersey, and it was the Gleis, the synthetic ice, because you couldn't get on real ice over COVID. So they started running that, which was awesome, and I finished up. And they started running that, which was awesome, and I finished up, and they were growing. You know they were doing a really good job. You know it went from, you know, one kid one hour to two kids in an hour to four hours and four kids, and you know, just kept going and going and going and you know, went from going to the kids houses to them, coming to them, and you know they really did the foundational groundwork which you know, which has set up, set up top line today. And you know, as that grew, and then I, I ended up coming back to New York, um, and it was kind of serendipitous the timing, cause they had just been established in Newburgh, um, so for people that don't know, that's where the Mid-Hudson Steel play up at ice time. Um, mike Leahy runs that rink, who's awesome, um, him and his wife, jackie, and they were great to us. We ended up building a gym there the summer I came back, which was our first gym that we built for Topline and we ran a lot of our online sessions at their rink.
Speaker 2:And then, you know, as we started growing, you know more and more people. I live in Manhattan, I live in the city, so I was going up there every day and, you know, some kids were starting to come up there from the city and they were like, hey, did you want to do some stuff in the city? And I was like, yeah, sure. And then next thing, you know, I mean everyone, every skills coach knows how this goes. You know. Next thing, you know you're doing six AMs with one kid and then another kid strolls by, and now you're doing five days a week and now you're getting nice later. Now you're going back, know, six, seven hours of sessions a day and um, but no, I mean, it grew pretty quickly. You know, we we got in um to city ice, I want to say about two years ago now, where we built that gym, um, and now we run all the on and off by sessions for the tier one team that runs out of there, the nychc um. And we just finished building our third facility in wyckoff, new jersey, um. We opened that in march of this year and, yeah, we've kind of grown as a staff, we've hired a couple more people and I think, yeah, no, it's been interesting.
Speaker 2:It's one of those things where you feel like you could write a book about every single day just because of the most ridiculous stuff that happens. It's just when you think things are going smooth, a kid forgets his skate, or a kid forgets his glove, and you know, you, you have one left glove on cause he's wearing your left glove and it's way too big for him. And the other kid, you know, was 15 minutes late Once the stand, 15 minutes late, like you know how it goes. There's just always something and but no, I mean it's, it's been incredible, honestly, the amount of people you meet and the connections that you make and the people that coached you when you were younger. You can now kind of give back and it's it's.
Speaker 2:It's kind of come full circle right, because my, my coach at boarding school met her. You know I used to babysit his kids when I was playing for him there and now his, his older son now is playing in Rochester in the NOL and I was. I was skating and working him out in the in the summer and then his daughter, jillian. She's, I think, a junior now at Deerfield, um, we skate and worked her out in the summer.
Speaker 2:So it's been cool to see that stuff come full circle, um, and to kind of be able to kind of give back to the people who helped me in my career and and help them, you know, um, develop their kids Um, because, you know, I think an advantage we have is we're not too far removed from the game, right, but we are far enough removed where we can, you know, talk to the parents and they can understand our perspective, but yet we can still relate to the kids and see it from their perspective. So, no, it's been incredible and we've had a lot of support from from other skills coaches around. We do a lot of collaborative work with, with everybody and all of these different rings. So so, yeah, it's it's, it's been a fun ride so far and I think we still have a pretty long ways to go that's awesome.
Speaker 1:No, I love, I love all the work that you guys are doing now and the training that you guys are putting in, especially. You know, I feel like off season everybody's always looking for opportunities to jump into another clinic or another training session and see something new, and you know we always talk about um. It's. It's good for kids to be able to kind of see and diversify. But, as you mentioned earlier, I think you're being a part of a certain club and being and leaving for reasons like, hey, you know, parallel a to a, but just leaving to a different club because your kid's not performing hard enough, as opposed to going in and taking some extra lessons. Uh, you know, sometimes that's kind of like a detriment in our sport, right?
Speaker 2:yeah, no, it is, yeah, it's, it's just part of the extra work you you mentioned a while ago and and you know there's I won't name his name, but there's, you know a kid who was skating with us three years ago and and even four years ago actually, and, and you know, all the other parents didn't want him on the ice.
Speaker 2:You know he's slowing down the drills, he's this, he's that. Well, you know what that kid ended up committing to michigan. You know a couple, you know, I think it was last summer, um, so it, and now all of those same parents, same kids, hey, hey, when's, when's when someone's so skating, hey, let us know when someone's so it's going to be in the gym. Like you work so hard, like it's so good for my kid and I'm just, obviously, you know we let them know. You know we want everyone to work together, but the back of our minds were like, you know, you didn't even want this kid on the ice with your son three years ago, but and now everybody wants to follow in his path. So it's interesting Like that stuff happens and that stuff is real.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it happens more often than not, right?
Speaker 1:I love to use.
Speaker 1:Scott Pippen is a great story, right, because he was a tall boy with his basketball team in college because he was too short and then he grew like 17 inches over summer and became the all-favorite point guard.
Speaker 1:So we see that all the time, right? We see those kids that are struggling and then you try to explain to parents that there are, you know, certain games tight games, maybe you're going to play your top players, but then there's other games where it's just a little lopsided or you're up by three or down by three or whatever, and you're giving opportunities to the kids who don't really get opportunities normally, right. So you kind of trying to balance the whole spectrum and giving everybody opportunities to play those power plays, penalty kills and experiences. But if you want to play at a higher level and you're playing on the third or fourth line, that's not the worst thing in the world. You know you can use that, as you've been saying so many times now. You know how you can use that to motivate you to get to that next level and to get to those top two lines.
Speaker 2:Absolutely the guy in boarding school to being top six my freshman year to bottom six for two years, then top six again my senior year to a bottom six guy in the NHL.
Speaker 2:I've seen it all, I've played it all. I've been on the penalty kill, I've been on the power play, I've sat on the bench the last 10 minutes of the game. I get it. So it's good. It's good to be able to see all of the different sides of it and to understand them and kind of soak it in and understand why you're feeling the way you're feeling and not just point fingers. Because you know, as as I'm sure you tell your kids, like as you get to the higher levels, there's no, you know, calling the coach and complaining it's it's up to you like you need to make a change, you need to make a decision, and you know I calling the coach and complaining it's it's up to you Like you need to make a change, you need to make a decision, and you know, I think that that's probably the most important part about hockey. It's just the lessons you learn and to learn to not only work with people from a fundamental standpoint but to understand how to adapt to the situations around you.
Speaker 1:And I know earlier you mentioned something that really extorted out to me. You said you accepted your role with different teams, right, and I had Theo Fleury on the show earlier. I'm going to just you know 14th or 15th episode and that's one of the things he said. Because he was, you know, small and he came into Calgary and you know he's like in an Olympic team with Gretzky and Lemieux and all those guys. He's like I was like what was that like? Because he was a, they put him on a fourth line because all these guys we know are legends.
Speaker 1:He was like, well, he's like I accepted my role. He's like I had a role to play. He's like I realized that you know, when I skated I was willing to die for that puck and 90% of the other people weren't. And he's like, and that was my, my purpose, he's gonna end up with a gold medal because I exactly took up my role. So, yeah, maybe you could talk a little bit about that concept. And you know how do you help kids to understand like they come to you for skill training, but I'm sure they they kind of inquire with you and look for advice from you in terms of how do they accept their position now and as they're working towards something bigger, yeah, no, that's a really good question.
Speaker 2:And and and I think the number one thing I say actually I had a kid the other day come and the mom was. The mom was just like yeah, you know it's been frustrating she, she was good about it, she was like it's been. You know, he was playing center last year and he was kind of like the go-to guy and now he's playing right winger, you know, as a lefty, and I'm like, well, okay, well, that means that he's going to be making a lot of plays on his backhand. Has he been working on his backhand? And she was like not really. Like, I'm playing right wing as a lefty. That means I'm going to be catching passes on my backhand. I'm going to have to make a lot of plays to the middle of my backhand. Yes, if I can cut across, I'm in an advantage. But to get there I got to get stronger on my backhand. So, like that whole session, I was like listen, backhand everything. We're going to catch passes skating full speed. We're going to catch passes skating backwards. You're going to catch rims. You're going to learn how to get this puck from your backhand to your forehand the most efficient, the most quickly. And I'm going to talk to you about different areas of the ice where you should understand when to use your backhand, when not to use your backhand, where you're vulnerable, where you're not vulnerable and, honestly, it's. It was such a good session for him because I think that not only he left there more confident, but just with a better understanding of what a right winger does in the game of hockey, because I think, like you said, these kids they only see highlights, they only see Panarin skating from the blue line in cutting across scoring the Rangers win three to two. Everybody's happy, but they don't see him at the training facility picking up 50 rims in a row, messing up 30 of them, figuring out when to cut to the ice, when to stay tight to the boards, and I think that accepting a role isn't.
Speaker 2:Oh, I had a good shift and I blocked a shot as a bottom six guy. Okay, put me back up at the top six, it's okay. What did you do before you blocked that shot? Were you even in the right position? Was you blocking that shot, making up for you being out of position? What did you do after the block shot? Did you chase it down? Did you get it deep? Did you have a turnover at the blue line. Did you try to make a play, you would have made playing as a top six guy.
Speaker 2:Because all of these things, when you really just boil them down, is when you look at a Stanley cup team, like you know the, the Florida Panthers, like the guys who are helping them, truly, when these games aren't the guys scoring the goals, it's, it's the guys who are causing those turnovers at the blue line, like everybody you know wants to talk about that play. You know that that happened with truba. Um, they're like, why did he step there at the blue line? Well, because he's trying to make a play to help his team win, and at the highest levels in the world someone has to win and someone has to lose. Like he took a rest risk, the puck went by, they went on an on-man rush. But you know what, you know what nobody talks about. Where was the third guy? That was the third guy, high, that was supposed to be back checking right. Like that guy didn't accept his role. That guy assumed Trouba was going to be able to take out two guys and get him the puck.
Speaker 2:So I think there's so many examples over the game of hockey that people can kind of pull and grab at. But hockey that people can kind of pull and grab at. But I think accepting your role is just more of what your parents are seeing and what the coach is happy with. When you are truly on the ice it's. Did you watch? You know a player who plays on his off wing? You know.
Speaker 2:Learn how to pick up rims. Learn, you know how to cut to the middle. Learn how to communicate with his center, his center low and slow, or his center breaking three. Like does he need to get it off the glass? Like there's so many little things these kids can do and at the end of the day, it's not their fault. They don't know, they're kids. Like it's up to people like me and you, you know, to teach them, to help them understand it.
Speaker 2:But like, going back, I think that kid left that session, you know not, like I said, more confident, but he understood his role as a right winger now. So now when he gets to the next level and his coach says, hey, you're playing center again. Boom, that's easy, I know how to play center or the next level, you know. He goes to college. Boom, you're a winger. Yeah, I know how to do. I don't want to play as a right winger, that's great, so so I I think it's truly fun understanding and and and learning everything around that position, not just what you guys see, you know, in the highlight reels yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1:Thank you, that. That was incredible. That's actually something that mike is is struggling with now. My middle one that was mentioning earlier is is exactly that situation. He was the center. Now, yes, he's kind of interchangeably, mostly playing right wing and and the same thing, so he's it's hard for him to to get those pucks, especially on the walls. When he picks it up and one of them he's trying to just quickly chip it up the wall and it goes right to the other defenseman. We talk a lot about being patient with the puck, making conscious plays and everything we do with purpose. You can justify why did you make that play? Why did you move the puck that way or this way instead of holding on to it and making a play? So you're not.
Speaker 2:You know you get the nerves out of it exactly and and for that, like we, we, we tell kids like video, video, video, video, video, watch yourself, watch yourself, watch yourself. Because the best advice I ever got as a kid was you never played as well as you think you did and you never played as bad as you think you did, until you watch video. And there's a lot of like oh, does that happen when you sit there and watch video with kids?
Speaker 1:so, yeah, I would harp on video a lot then awesome and I, you know, I had a really funny story with my older one. He, um, he was at a game and you know I couldn't be there, I was coaching my other kid. And so he comes home and you know he had a penalty late in the game and he's like, you know, they gave me a penalty, but I was nowhere near the guy, it was the other kid that did it. And then you know, we go on live bar and I pull up the video and literally slow-mo, he comes in two-handed right against the other guy. The guy goes flying. I was like, wait a second, that wasn't you right? Let's rewind, let's see who that really was. And he's like okay, I got it. I was like, but he was so convinced yeah, it wasn't for the video, there's just no argument.
Speaker 2:He was like you might have believed him too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but he was convinced himself. He was shocked. He was shocked, he was himself. He was yeah, you were shy. He was like yeah, how did that happen? I was like no, that that's you, buddy, that was you I know, it's so, I know it's, it's so funny, like it's.
Speaker 2:The kids are just they, you're right. Like they convince themselves so much that they almost convince me too, right like that wasn't me that shot that puck. I'm like actually was it. And then you look back. I'm like it was you that shot right because you start doubting.
Speaker 1:You say like, maybe I got it wrong, maybe I was looking, so I don't know no, it's true, it is now. They're hilarious well, that's the well. I know we're coming up on the hour, but I always like to close out the show with a few rapid fire questions, so I'm gonna put them up on screen. Uh, first one is what do you think motivates athletes?
Speaker 2:um, I think what motivates athletes is you know what got them into, you know their sport in the first place.
Speaker 2:I think that it's easy to kind of get blinded by okay, you know, I want to go to the nhl, I want to make millions of dollars. Okay, that's great, everybody wants to do that. But how badly do you want to do that when it's pouring outside and you're at the track? Do you still want to do that? And you know when the ice is melted and you have to stay for an extra hour, and it's 11 o'clock and now you're going to go on the ice at 12 o'clock, do you still want to stay and do that? So I think I think you learn a lot about yourself as an athlete when things are going poorly, kind of like what we were talking about. When you're put in a position you're not normally used to playing and you go home that night and say I don't want to play hockey anymore. Do you go home that night and say, okay, I'm gonna adapt and I'm gonna learn and I'm gonna figure out how to get better at this specific part of my game in order to become a more well-rounded hockey player?
Speaker 1:awesome. Uh, next player, awesome. Next question Name three character traits you notice in successful athletes.
Speaker 2:I think, right off the bat, number one is consistency. I think some of the best athletes you see in the world just to have their whatever it's, their routine or their warm up. I think consistency is absolutely number one. I think another one would be discipline. Obviously, you know that comes up a lot, obviously, but I think that you know being able to, you know, block out noise and being able to truly focus. And I think one thing I like to say a lot with the kids is just be present, right, like, don't worry about the team you're playing this weekend, don't worry about, you know, the team you played last weekend, like, be present. And if you're able to be present and you know, with consistent on top of that, I think that you know, I think that that's just, that's unbeatable.
Speaker 2:Um, a third trait I think is would be, you know, passion for, for the sport. I think people who, people who, who make it to the highest levels, like they truly it. It's not a oh, I'm doing this to make money or I'm doing this because it's something that I'm good at. You don't play in the NHL because you're good at hockey. You play in the NHL because you love hockey so much that you've spent the last whatever 20 something years of your life dedicating yourself to shooting, passing, skating, weight you've you've sacrificed a lot. Your parents have sacrificed a lot.
Speaker 1:So I think those three I think consistency, discipline and passion kind of complete a well-rounded athlete I love it and you know it made me think of yarmir yager, who's still playing in the pro leagues he's player.
Speaker 2:Owner left winger.
Speaker 1:Like it's crazy, it's nuts, just like the guys you know, gonna be 78 years old, playing professional cocky like sweden he's a terminator. It's crazy so cool, uh. One more question here is if you can name three things that hold athletes back.
Speaker 2:I think first thing that comes up for me would be fear. I think and I think that's something I kind of struggle with I think fear is something that holds a lot of athletes back. It's the fear of losing, it's the fear of getting caught, it's the fear of putting yourself in a situation where you may not be successful. And I, you know, I wish I did that more. I wish I skated with guys that were better than me a lot more. Instead, I, you know, I wish I did that more. I wish I skated with guys that were better than me a lot more, instead of, you know, skating with guys I knew I was better than or as good as right. And I think this one kind of piggybacks off of it, I think doubt, because I think, kind of coming off of fear, then kids start to doubt themselves and like, do I belong in this league, do I belong in this team? Do I belong here in general? Like, is this, you know, something that I can, you know I can find success in?
Speaker 2:And I think the third thing, I don't know, a couple different things come up.
Speaker 2:I would say one thing I think, for a lot of kids I see now is kind of being inquisitive, asking questions and understanding, right, because it's one thing to have a coach show you a cool drill and you'll be able to do it, but why are you doing it and when in a game should you be doing this? And I think one thing that's cool about a lot of kids that we have now is and kids in general is they're so inquisitive now and they because I'm an adult and because I said so, it doesn't really work anymore, right, like sometimes kids will be like why are we doing this exercise? Or like, what is this show going to help us with in a game? And it forces coaches to honestly learn themselves to, to, to figure out why they are teaching these kids these things and when it is going to be useful, and I feel like it makes the sessions more efficient and more productive and just better well-rounded as a whole.
Speaker 2:So I think that those three definitely are things that I honestly felt like held me back a little bit and I would like to see a little bit less of these kids if they're able to control that.
Speaker 1:Awesome. I mean that's pretty much the main reason I teach Michigan for at least 30 minutes of every practice. Just to make sure you know, because that's going to happen, Cut that part out.
Speaker 2:Okay, what?
Speaker 1:about some dive guys. Let's go.
Speaker 1:It's funny because if you do say that there are like two kids who will start to do it, you're like, okay, we're not actually going to do that right, no, I usually play around with the uh, with the junior rangers kids, I'll be doing learn to play and I'll pick up the puck on my stick and I'll be like okay, now, everybody else, they all look at me as I'm kidding me. So it's a lot of fun. Uh, boo. Thank you so much. I know we went a little bit longer than than anticipated, but I really appreciate your time. This was so informative and helpful. Um, if people want to find a top line hockey, where do they go?
Speaker 2:um. So you can find us at toplinehockeycom um on instagram, at topline hockey um TikTok, all that good stuff. We're everywhere. And then we're located at City Ice Pavilion and the Graveyard, both in Long Island City. We run sessions out of Sportarama American Dream. We're up in Newburgh at ice time, we're out in Wyckoff, Hawthorne area, so, yeah, we kind of cover most of the tri-state area. So yeah, just give us a shout, send us a message on the app, on the website, on Instagram. We'll get right back to you and we'll find some sessions for you.
Speaker 1:Wonderful. Thank you so much again. Thank you everybody who joined in and listened. If you do have questions for Boo and you'd like to ask them, you can send them to me at the Podolsky method on Instagram or Facebook or, you know, reach out to booze through social media through his top line page. Thanks again, we appreciate your time.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1:All right, Well with that, everybody. Have a wonderful rest of your day.